Hounds at One Loudoun or Bust?
Opponents are not buying assertions that Loudoun professional sports rely on a ballpark at the development.
As the Loudoun Planning Commission wades through a proposal to permit a 5,500-seat stadium in the One Loudoun development, the case supporters appear to be developing is that Loudoun could miss its opportunity to land two professionals sports teams.
Opponents of the ballpark aren't buying it. Those against the park – whose concerns include noise, lights, traffic and the loss of planned office space – turned out along with supporters for a public hearing Tuesday night in Leesburg.
Comments were pretty evenly divided. Opponents included residents of the Potomac Green and Ashbrook communities, and those concerns about the Blue Heron rookery nearby; but there were also supporters from Potomac Green. Supporters primarily included baseball and soccer fans, and several people affiliated with the team.
Those opposing the stadium, for the most part, said they were opposed to the location, not the concept.
Bob Farren, president and CEO of VIP Sports & Entertainment, the group assembling the Loudoun Hounds professional baseball club, said failure at One Loudoun could result in the loss of the opportunity not only for baseball, but also the North American Soccer League team, Virginia Cavalry FC, which plans to share the stadium.
"Beginning play for the 2014 season at One Loudoun is critical for the Hounds and Cavalry,” he said. “This is the main reason we moved from our previous site to the current one.”
Farren said Thursday that the leagues are expecting the teams to play in 2014 and One Loudoun offers the only viable option.
Several opponents pointed out that the stadium remains approved at Kincora, suggesting that’s the best place for the ballpark. That approval expires in 2014. Infrastructure delays at Kincora would not permit completion of the park in time for 2014, according to representatives from the Hounds.
“If we slip to 2015, the awarded franchises for Loudoun could be lost and assigned to other areas of the country,” Farren said. “We are not in a position where we can wait any longer. "
A group called No Stadium on Route 7 has formed, although its membership remains anonymous. An inquiry about Farren’s assertions resulted in a response from the “NSO7 team” doubting whether the Hounds have actually locked down a baseball team. During the planning commission’s hearing Tuesday, Commission Helena Syska (Sterling) asked why the startup team does not yet exist. The NSO7 response suggested offered a similar concern.
“Instead there is a front office with a few executives and a very well-oiled PR machine,” the NSO7 response stated. “The Hounds have successfully managed to build the perception that there is an actual team. The Atlantic League's rules specifically state that a stadium built to certain specifications must be built before a team franchise is awarded. The resurrected North American Soccer League [doesn't] have such strict standards and awarded VIP Sports & Entertainment a franchise on speculation.”
The league’s rules for new franchises was not listed on its website http://atlanticleague.com/atl-about.php , but the following statement was posted about league stadiums:
“New AL facilities will fully comply with ‘Facility Standards’ as defined by the National Association of Professional Baseball Leagues Inc. (“NA”), the governing body of minor league baseball. Players will be assured of field conditions that meet or exceed the standards for Triple AAA classification NA facilities. Communities must demonstrate market size sufficient to support a minimum ballpark size of 5,000 to 7,500 seats.”
Colleen Gillis Snow, an attorney representing One Loudoun, said the team indeed has an agreement with the league and offered to provide proof to the Loudoun County Attorney's office in the form of a redacted copy.
“It has been executed," Snow said Tuesday. "I just literally got it in my hands ... It does exist. The Atlantic League understands the Hounds desire to be in this location and they have granted the franchise contingent on this approval being given.”
Snow also suggested the proposed ballpark is much farther away from the rookery than the stadium previously envisioned at Kincora and should not have the same fireworks and construction restrictions.
The planning commission forwarded the proposal to a work session for further review before commissioners make a recommendation to the board of supervisors.
[Editor's note: One Loudoun responded during Tuesday's hearing about whether the Hounds have a contractual agreement with the Atlantic League. That comment has been added.]
[Correction: The Hounds are not part of the Minor League Baseball, which is a specific league affilicated with Major League Baseball. The term is trademarked. The Atlantic League is an independent league.]
K
8:18 am on Friday, February 22, 2013
Traffic would be a nightmare, more than it already is! They should find another location!
Michael Kimmel
8:21 am on Friday, February 22, 2013
If the Planning Commission and BOS want to continue to have Loudoun County resident dollars spent in Frederick and deny Loudoun County residents some local entertainment then they should squash the plans to build the stadium. I for one think that would be a bad idea and am optimistic the approval for the stadium will be given and something besides houses which choke our schools and roads and half empty strip maills can be built in the county.
Jackieh
2:25 pm on Friday, February 22, 2013
I don't believe anyone is denying Loudoun County residents a stadium. We just want it in a more accessible location than at the intersection of LC Parkway and Rt. 7 where the infrastructure is totally inadequate. I do not want the original plans for the One Loudoun International Trade Center changed and have it become a venue with sports bars, fast-food restaurants, and seasonal, part-time, low-paying jobs. We have enough of those all around Eastern Loudoun. Not enough thought and planning is going into this make-over which the Board of Supervisors hopes to "fast-track" to the top of the pile (of plans waiting in line for approval). How much influence can $67,000 in political contributions buy?
Dylan M.
3:12 pm on Friday, February 22, 2013
They have to be in a ballpark in 2014 according to this article. There is absolutely nothing at Kincora that would allow them to be there in 2014. The fire and rescue station is being built by the County - there are no roads so this is a non starter. I am sure Kincora will be built, but it sure as heck won't be fore 2014.
Let's keep this to reality - from listening to the public hearing, noise, traffic and light seem like its going to be handled. Don't forget, this request is only moving the ballpark a mile.
Sheri
4:49 pm on Friday, February 22, 2013
Yes! I agree, I would love to drive up the road on a nice evening to catch a ball game or concert.
Myth Buster
11:56 am on Friday, February 22, 2013
BUST. Can the PR machine of the Loudoun Hounds remind the tax payers, who are the team players, coach etc. Wait...there aren't any because this is just a PR machine with no substance.
Jim
12:18 pm on Friday, February 22, 2013
What are the Hounds supposed to offer coaches and players right now? How can they ask people to move to Loudoun County when they cannot tell them if the stadium will even be approved?
I am positive they are working on plans to get players and coaches once the stadium is approved.
Come on Board of Supervisors and Planning Commission- get this done so construction can start!
Michael Kimmel
12:35 pm on Friday, February 22, 2013
I'm with Jim -- you can't have a coach and players without a place to play. It's like asking the county school board who the teachers and principal are for a school that hasn't yet been approved to be built.
Myth Buster
2:29 pm on Friday, February 22, 2013
the Hounds had a home: Kinkora but they delayed the start date at least 3 times. The Hounds are doing yet another bait and switch , only now they have changed locations from Kinkora to One Loudoun. This is nothing more than a sketchy PR media blitz.
Dylan M.
3:00 pm on Friday, February 22, 2013
no franchise with plans to play in 2014 would have a player or a coach right now. Any player who is on the Hounds squad in 2014 are definitely playing in 2013 for another team somewhere. Who in the world would sign for 2014, that's just silly.
Jim
4:15 pm on Friday, February 22, 2013
I'm trying to follow your logic Myth Buster but I'm not tracking. You say the Hounds are a PR machine who keep pulling a bait and switch, ok I get that part- I don't agree with hit but I get what you're saying, my question is why? What good does it do them to put on this "PR Blitz"?
Paul
9:34 am on Wednesday, February 27, 2013
So, Myth Buster, are you saying that the Hounds should have started building at Kincorra, without roads or approvals, in the face of all the legal conflict that has prevented any development at Kincorra? And at the same time, they should have a coach and players sitting around waiting for a field to play on? Sorry, the world doesn't work that way. Kincorra is a myth, and something will eventually get built on that site, but not this year, not next year, and probably nothing like the plans we saw back when Kincorra was real. There has been and will not be any real option to build a stadium there. No stadium, no field, means no players and no coaches. You can't hire a bunch of athletes to sit around and lose their athletic skills while you wait for local government to figure out what they need to do to enable construction in a rapidly growing county.
Nice talking points by the way. Did you focus group the phrase "PR machine"?
Gary Evans
12:52 pm on Friday, February 22, 2013
Traffic was less dense before Potomac Green was built. Now hundreds of new homes, condos, etc. are standing up in that vicinity. They will choke the traffic more than a few ballgames and events. Our children had open fields to play in, football, frisbee, paintball, etc. Pet owners had a place to let their animals run free. Deer and wildlife ran free in the area. Now all of that is gone, and we adjust. Don't cite the Blue Heron, you can't be an animal rights lover for one species and not all the others. Your arguments smack of NIMBY, NIMBY, NIMBY. Well, you are in my backyard and I have adjusted. Why deny children, grandchildren and families a central place for entertainment?
James
1:19 pm on Friday, February 22, 2013
HERE, HERE!!! More traffic comes from Potomac Green with there ONE ENTRANCE. They are building condo's now talk about more traffic in the area!
Greg DiMuzio
2:14 pm on Friday, February 22, 2013
Bad location, bad idea. Why increase the traffic burden on the route seven corridor? It would cost millions to make the necessary modifications. We can't even agree on a long term transportation plan for the region. If opponents are not vocal enough and arm themselves with facts, the BOS will rubberstamp the plan without considering the plight of the residents of Eastern Loudoun. Common sense would dictate placement nearer to the new Silver Line so that attendees could use the metro vice drive. As an alternative, why not consider the Route 50 corridor with its wide open spaces: "if you build it they will come." Loudoun would still win. In any event, don't let the corporate apparatus hold the county hostage with their veiled threats. There are and will be other significant opportuniities for Loudoun that will support job growth to a much greater degree than minor league sports teams. Final thought: no back room tax deals for the teams/stadium. They must pay their full share from day one. Furthermore, there must be no added tax or fee burden placed on county residents should the sportsplex deal materialize.
Jim
4:18 pm on Friday, February 22, 2013
So if the stadium does not get built, the space would be filled by.....offices! Full of people who have cars and do not carpool- and they show up every day at rush hour.
Ballgames may start later in the rush hour but will end later than rush hour so really not a huge impact. Plus, not everyone drives themselves to a game, they have their families and friends with them. If the space were taken up by offices you would have thousands of people driving in and out during rush hour.
Paul
9:41 am on Wednesday, February 27, 2013
The millions of square feet of retail and office, and the thousands of homes, are going to place a heavy burden on traffic patterns. If the stadium doesn't happen we can look forward to all the traffic being on the same schedule as the rest of the congestion. Yay.
dave stinson sr
4:45 pm on Friday, February 22, 2013
It's interesting that a group with anonymous members is even mentioned or quoted. As I tell my children/grandchildren..never be ashamed to speak. Never hide behind anonymity.
I would suggest that those on the planning board should do their "homework" (at least know something about the groups appearing before them). It baffles me why anyone would expect any 2014 activity whether sports, theater, etc. to be in existence today. I believe one serious challenge opponents and proponents may face is that those on the Planning Board (hopefully not the BOS) do not understand the business model of sports and entertainment.
No stadium--no games..no players..not hard to figure that out...also no entertainment, no revenue, no family fun.
Dusty Smith
4:51 pm on Friday, February 22, 2013
Fair point about using the anonymous group's comment in the original story. I would argue that there are clearly opponents who agree with the group (they spoke at the hearing). But point taken. Thanks for weighing in.
Myth Buster
6:10 pm on Friday, February 22, 2013
The opposition group isn't all that anonymous it's a conglomeration of several HOAs who have decided to be united in their opposition. Since the BoS and Hounds did a bait and switch. The real question is the anonymous nature of the Hounds, again this professional team has no affiliation with any MLB (or minor league) franchise. They have had several "shell" companies VIP, VIP Entertainment & Farren etc, all of which were very heavy campaign donors to several current BoS members.
The Hounds & Fetch splashed on to the Loudoun scene in 2009, with delay after delay. Four years later Loudoun is still no where close to having an actual professional sports team. And the notion Loudoun needs the Hounds for entertainment is hysterical. Wasn't the push for the Silver line is it would help Loudoun residents get down to DC for all sports & concert venues?
Jackieh
8:05 pm on Saturday, February 23, 2013
DS, sr. Everyone who spoke before the Planning Commission wrote down their names, addresses, and phone numbers for the record. In addition, we all gave our names before speaking. There was no anonymity.
After hearing the questions asked by the Commissioners, I am very confident they did their "homework" and are fully aware of the pros and cons of allowing the zoning change and all the consequences.
SeasonedCitizen
6:03 pm on Friday, February 22, 2013
The reason they want to remain anonymous is simple; they are not protected by a team of attorneys on retainer or under the umbrella of an LLC like Mr. Farren and his numerous companies. Opponents have had to be very careful not to say, post, or communicate anything other than facts or questions. Any misstep could be used as grounds to sue them. Since the rezoning announcement was made last October and organized opposition began to form soon after you will notice that nobody has been able to accuse these folks of anything other than being NIMBYs, which is odd considering there was no opposition to the approved Kincora location about a mile to the East.
Myth Buster
6:25 pm on Friday, February 22, 2013
That's my point. The BoS "fast tracked" this rezoning application. Farren paid for at least one trip for Chairman York to go to Germany. And VIP donated tens of thousands to nearly all of the current BoS. The whole move from Kinkora to One Loudoun just smacks of buying political influence. Farren and Company (to include their super awesome PR guy, David D'Onofrio) aren't afraid of pulling the trigger on suing anyone who opposes or questions the Hounds.
At the end of the day, imagine buying a $600K home, moving in with your family, only to find out a mutli-use stadium is likely to be approved literally in your backyard. If I purchased a home in One Loudoun, I would be pissed too.
Paul
9:44 am on Wednesday, February 27, 2013
And if I had bought a home in One Loudoun, and found that a stadium is being added, I would be thrilled. Neither of us actually have bought a home there.
Again, how were the Hounds supposed to move into Kincorra, when Kincorra hasn't been able to do anything in years?
Jeffrey Trooper Vogel
6:08 pm on Friday, February 22, 2013
I would be very suspicious of anything that comes out of the mouths of Bill May or any of the other Loudoun One representatives from Miller and Smith. I just signed a contract on a home and they were deceitful about the pricing on the house until I was sitting there with my wife to sign the contract and then it was oh sorry about the $13,000 in extra charges...which they previously told me wouldn't be applied. Well when my wife is sitting there and wants the house I wasn't going to make a scene. One of the higher ups at Miller and Smith called me the following day and said well if you don't want the lot you don't have to take it and she basically said I was lying and new the costs. The bottom line is that they are not a transparent company, they don't take responsibility for their actions, and they have an F Rating from the BBB.
Jonathan Weintraub
6:48 pm on Friday, February 22, 2013
Interesting use of divide and conquer. If a couple can't get it together to "fight the power," God help us.
Web Junkyy
6:48 pm on Friday, February 22, 2013
Jeffrey - that does not surprise me, I was told by one of the buyers that they did not tell them about the stadium before closing. With a stadium only a few blocks away and the possiblity of 5,000 cars literally streaming past their front door on Exchange st coming and going to a game or concert, is that any way to do business? If a stadium so nearby is such as wonderful thing, why are they keeping it from potential buyers?
Also fishy is the recent article I saw that One Loudoun sold 13 acres of land to Loudoun County for $8.8 million dollars so they can build a sheriff's station, that's pretty expensive per acre! And to boot, there is alreay a sheriff's station 1.5 miles away. They must be expecting that the stadium is going to bring the need for law enforcement to be very close by? Oh, that's comforting.
Now watch, they will try to get out of the Ashburn Village overpass proffer! In my opinion, taxpayers will somehow, someway get stuck with that bill in the end.
Jeffrey Trooper Vogel
8:34 pm on Friday, February 22, 2013
http://www.loudountimes.com/index.php/news/article/one_loudoun_sold_787for_35_million_to_original_owner/
This is a link to the story back in 2010. Miller and Smith went belly up on the 125M note they had on One Loudoun so they went into foreclosure so us poor suckers could pay the loss and then they turned around and bought it for 35M and then charge Loudoun County outrageous amounts to build a substation.
Jackieh
7:49 pm on Saturday, February 23, 2013
And we, the taxpayers, will be screwed once again if Miller and Smith brings the stadium to One Loudoun. I sure wish I could claim bankruptcy on my house and repurchase it for a fraction of the original price. And a sheriff's substation to be built in One Loudoun? Isn't there one right across Route 7 near the University?
SeasonedCitizen
8:57 pm on Friday, February 22, 2013
As they say if you aren't outraged you must not be paying attention. The taxpayers essentially just paid off 25% of the $35M with the purchase of the land for the new sheriffs station. Absolutely unbelievable. Good post on the public hearing over at nostadiumon7.org
Jim
10:39 pm on Friday, February 22, 2013
Revisionist history is at work here. I have to chuckle when I read comments that say the ballpark had no opposition when it was going to be built at Kincora. I attended one of the BOS meetings and the meeting was full of people who opposed the stadium- for all the same reasons I am reading from the opponents of the One Loudoun location. Now I bet those people are happy because the stadium is not being built in their backyard.
Hate to say it but I believe you would be hard pressed to find a home builder who actually told the truth these days!
Jackieh
7:56 pm on Saturday, February 23, 2013
I received an e-mail from Camberly Homes announcing the release of more lots. The homes are close to $700,000 "featuring community elementary school, community recreation center with pool, courts, and fields, central park, town green, amphitheater, pocket parks, paved pedestrian pathways.... You have to dig down into their website to find anything about the stadium--but no promises, of course.
I wonder how many of the new residents along Exchange Street and in all those townhomes know/knew about the possibility of the stadium and all that it entails.